Why I believe the post-trib, pre-wrath rapture
Background
Like many of my friends and family I grew up in a Baptist church and went to church on Sunday and Wednesday pretty much every week. Since I was little I was always told that Jesus was coming back before the tribulation, and in fact, he could come back at any moment. “No man knows the day or the hour” is what I heard pastors and Sunday school teachers say.
I can remember being in college and reading this passage in Matthew 24:
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
I was confused because that sure does point to a post-trib rapture, but I talked myself out of it. I just figured that the pastors that were teaching the pre-trib rapture knew a lot more than me. Maybe I needed to go to bible college or something to really understand what the bible was saying. I figured that there was no way that all the pastors and teachers out there were wrong.
Over the last year I have studied this topic in depth. I have memorized every rapture passage that I could find in the bible. I asked a lot of questions to pre-trib rapture teachers and have come to the conclusion that the pre-trib rapture if a fraud.
What I believe
Here’s what I believe about the rapture. There will be a period of tribulation for 3.5 years that will begin when the anti-christ confirms a “covenant with many”. Then the abomination of desolation will happen at the 3.5 year mark. Then there will be an unknown number of days of great tribulation which is when Christians will be killed in mass. This may only last a few months. Then the rapture will happen followed by God pouring out his wrath on the same day as the rapture. God’s wrath continues for the remainder of the 3.5 years. In total there is 7 years of tribulation + wrath. The tribulation takes 3.5 years + a few months. God’s wrath is probably a little more than 3 years long. In total, there is 7 years of tribulation + wrath which is commonly called Daniel's 70th week.
Evidence
Here’s the evidence to back up my belief that the rapture and God’s wrath happen on the same day.
1. Here’s what Revelation 6 says about the 6th seal:
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.
14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
This is the end of the tribulation. I know this because in Matthew 24:29-31 Jesus said “Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken”
In Revelation 6:12 we see the sun darkened and the moon as blood which is the same as what Jesus said in Matthew 24:29. We also see an earthquake and the stars falling from heaven. To believe that those two passages are talking about different events is silly. They’re obviously the same thing.
2. In Revelation 7 we see the following:
9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
10 And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.
…
13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
So in Revelation 7, a great multitude appears in heaven right in the midst of Daniel's 70th week. One of the elders tells John that they came out of great tribulation. This is obviously the rapture. To believe in the pre-trib rapture, you would have to believe in at least 2 raptures (actually 4, but I’ll get to that later). I have never heard a sermon on Revelation 7 in my entire life. The reason is that it’s incredibly damning to the pre-trib rapture. They don’t want to talk about it.
3. Notice in Revelation 8 that the bible is very careful to note how much time has gone by. This is because God wants us to know that it’s still the same day as the rapture:
1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.
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7 The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.
God’s wrath starts when the first angel sounds his trumpet.
4. Jesus preached a post-trib, pre-wrath rapture in Luke 17:26-30:
26 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.
27 They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.
28 Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.
Pre-trib teachers never mention these verses. They want you to believe that people who are left behind are going to be asking where everyone went. Even if they were to say that the tribulation begins the day that the rapture happens, there is no sudden destruction when the tribulation begins. All the bible says about the beginning of the tribulation is that it starts with the confirmation of the “covenant with many” (Daniel 9:27):
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
5. The day of the Lord is the same day as the rapture. Acts 2:20 says that the sun and moon will go dark on the day of the Lord:
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:
Pre-trib rapture teachers will say that the day of the Lord is a 1000 year period of time. They say that because they don’t want to admit that the day of the Lord is when the 6th seal is opened in Revelation 6, even though the sun goes dark and the moon turns to blood. To believe the pre-trib rapture, you would have the believe the sun and moon go dark at least 3 times.
1. When Jesus said they go dark in Matthew 24:29.
2. When they go dark on the day of the Lord.
3. When they go dark when the 6th seal is opened.
Doesn’t it make way more sense to say that those 3 are all the same day?
Here’s more proof that the rapture and the day of the Lord are the same thing. Here’s the famous rapture passage in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and 5:1-4:
13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
The sudden destruction mentioned in v3 is about the wrath that gets poured out on the same day as the rapture.
Paul is equating the rapture and the day of the Lord. He does this again in 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3:
1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
He also makes sure to reiterate that the rapture will not happen until there comes a falling away first, and the man of sin be revealed. This is also an incredibly damning verse for pre-trib teachers because this is saying that the rapture won’t happen till the anti-christ comes which is happens at the beginning of the tribulation. That’s probably why I’ve never heard this passage preached about.
6. The rapture shows up again in Revelation 14.
First I want to talk about the order of events in Revelation. Revelation 1-11 is in chronological order, but then it starts over again in Revelation 12. Revelation 12-22 is also in chronological order. The proof of this is that in Revelation 11:15 it says:
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
This is talking about the beginning of the 1000 year reign of Christ. Then in Revelation 12, we’re back in the 1st century AD and we see the birth of Christ:
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.
Revelation 12-14 basically goes through the events of the tribulation again, then we see the rapture in Revelation 14:14-16:
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.
15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.
16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.
Then just like we would expect, we see God’s wrath being poured out right after that that in Revelation 14:17-20:
17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.
18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.
19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.
20 And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.
Once again, I have never heard a sermon on this passage in Revelation 14. In fact, every pre-trib teacher I've ever heard stays away from most of the book of Revelation. That’s probably because they don’t understand how it fits in with the pre-trib rapture.
Disproving the pre-trib rapture
I want to move in a different direction now and address some of the verses that pre-trib teachers say prove a pre-trib rapture.
1. Revelation 3:10
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
In Revelation 2-3, Jesus is giving specific messages to the 7 churches in Asia. This verse is directed towards the church of Philadelphia. Pre-trib teachers teach that the 7 church are really 7 church ages and that we’re living in the Laodicean age. They want to apply symbolic meaning to this passage. I don’t believe that, but even if you follow their logic, the Philadelphia age has already passed. They might say that Revelation 3:10 applies to all ages (because they say so), but I would respond that it’s just as much evidence of a pre-wrath rapture. There are so many clear passages that teach a post-trib, pre-wrath rapture and I would not ignore all those and apply symbolic meaning to a verse that would contradict all the other verses.
2. Revelation 4:1
1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter.
Some pre-trib teachers will say that Revelation 4:1 is the rapture. They basically came up with this because otherwise they would have to say that the rapture is not mentioned in Revelation which would seem ridiculous since it’s such a major end-time event. Here’s the problem with Revelation 4:1; it’s just John being called up to heaven. You would have to assign heavy symbolic meaning to this verse to believe it’s all believers. On top of that, they don’t even read the next verse:
2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
The rapture is a bodily resurrection, but John is telling us that he’s in the spirit. His body is still on earth. There’s no way that this is the rapture.
3. 1 Thessalonians 5:9
9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
There are a lot of verses that pre-trib teachers will point to involving wrath to try to justify the pre-trib rapture. They equate tribulation and wrath, but the bible is careful to make a distinction between those two things most of the time. Revelation 6 helps us understand exactly when God’s wrath starts:
9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
If the events of the first 4 seals in Revelation are part of God’s wrath, why are these martyrs asking God when he’s going to avenge their blood? Wouldn’t God have pointed them to the first 4 seals and told them that it’s already in progress?
Revelation 6:16-17 tells us when God’s wrath starts:
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
This lines up perfectly with Revelation 6:11 when God told them to rest a little season. This is because the 6th seal is probably a few months after the 5th seal, but we don’t know exactly how long because “no man knoweth the day or the hour.”
4. Here’s a “proof of the pre-trib rapture” that I heard in church once. Revelation 12:13:
13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.
The guy preaching this said that the dragon is persecuting the woman (who represents the Jews) because all the believers are gone. Here’s what’s so dumb about this argument. In Revelation 12:17 it says the following:
17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Just 4 verses down the bible makes it clear that there are more than just Jews that Satan makes war with.
Then Revelation 13:7 says:
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
So the bible is clear that the anti-christ makes war with the saints are believers of any nationality.
5. Some pre-trib teachers will say that Matthew 24 is about the Jews.
They say that the word elect means Jews because they are God’s elect. Mark 13 is a parallel passage to Matthew 24. It says all the same things as Matthew 24. But Mark records one more thing that Jesus said at the end in verse 37:
37 And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch.
It’s almost like Jesus knew that people would say that Matthew 24 is about the Jews only so he makes sure to mention that he’s talking to everyone, not just the Jews.
In addition to that, when the bible talks about the elect, it’s always talking about believers. Here’s one clear verse that shows that the elect are not the Jews (Revelation 11:7).
7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded
Before I go further, I want to mention that I am of Jewish descent. My grandmother escaped Germany during the Holocost and came to America. Her father was killed in the Holocost. I’m not some Jew hater. But I do want to tell people that this Jew worship that goes on in the churches in America is unbiblical. John 5:46 says:
46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
According to Jesus, Jews that reject Him don’t believe the old Testament. We don’t have the same God as them. He also said they would accept the anti-christ in John 5:43.
43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
I’ve heard preachers say that when Jesus comes in the clouds that the Jews will see him and believe. The truth is, they’ll accept the anti-christ as their messiah. I thank God that I won’t fall for that.
6. Here is proof that Matthew 24:29-31 is the rapture.
In 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18, we see the rapture described in great detail:
13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
Here are some things to note:
1. Jesus comes in the clouds
2. A trumpet sounds
3. We meet the Lord in the air
Here's Matthew 24:29-31 again:
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Same thing as 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18. Jesus comes in the clouds. A trumpet sounds. We're gathered together and brought to heaven.
How many raptures do you have to believe in to be pre-trib?I think you have to believe in at least 4 raptures.
1. The pre-trib rapture
2. The Matthew 24 rapture
3. The Revelation 7 rapture
4. The Revelation 14 rapture
Because of this, pre-trib teachers just stay away from Matthew 24, Revelation 7 and Revelation 14. It's too hard to explain. There are people that believe in 4 raptures though. They'll believe anything to hold on to the pre-trib rapture.
What to do about all this:
If you believe in the post-trib, pre-wrath rapture, you should tell others about it. You should prepare yourself spiritually. Matthew 13:20-21 says:
20 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21 Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
I'm telling you this so that you're not offended when the tribulation arises. Many Christians will be offended when the tribulation comes because they were told they would be kept from it.
Read Matthew 24 for yourself. In fact, read it 50 times (I'm serious). Jesus gives us instructions and warns us about how our own families will betray many of us.
